I might as well put this before I go to bed. I don't want to hold this off until later.

I think I understand why I have a hard time talking to anyone about the cross.

I haven't really ever had any deep and serious Christian fellowship with anyone face to face. When the once a month [and some times a month would be skipped depending on the whether] Christian club at school,Alethia,took place...that was a gathering but nothing really ever deep such as studying the cross. I don't even have that now since I graduated over 2 years ago.

I have known the JWs since the Summer of 08. A little over two years before Jesus even saved me. And I guess ever since than...By how they talked about the cross...it has made me fearful to ever talk about it. Stuff like "Would you wear an electric chair around your neck if your mother died in one?"

Mom has brought up the electric chair [I think she may have also said a knife another time...that may have been Lynda who brought that up though] thing in the past. She has gotton nervous and changed to channel at times when people talked about Jesus' death.

Note I think I do remember her saying something positive about the cross the other day and hasn't brought up about the "electric chair" comment in a long time. Praise Jesus!

Despite the JWs don't seem to come around anymore [Lynda throws watch towers over the fence since she can't open our gate we got last year] I think talking about that for so long has had an effect on me. I've read about people online defending the cross and brothern overseas who has defended the cross. But I've been taught in person only to be scared to talk about the cross. Not really anyone has taught me in person to defend it. How can all that time of being taught to be afraid to speak about the cross...how can all that time be erased? It's all I know from being taught by people in person. How can that be changed when there's no one in person who will teach me how to defend the cross and not be fearful to talk about it?

This is really helping me. I really needed to get it off my chest and now I'm starting to understand better one of the reasons why I have such a hard time talking to my parents/relatives.

I guess you could call it brainwashing. The JWs [mom has said a couple things in the past. I'm very greatful she said something positive about the cross the other day though] has said so much in the past...saying true Christians don't wear crosses,that it's pagan...And I think the elder's wife [or atleast someone did] brought up about "Would you wear a knife around your neck if one of your loved ones was killed with a knife?"

And they are just about the only people who has ever "taught" me face to face. The church I went to from April of 08-the fall of 08 was mainly just a youth group[adults in church were upstairs]. After the one lady couldn't do it anymore because of her legs it got to the point I couldn't stand being there. In youth group we didn't have too many serious discussions from what I remember. Oh,how I wish they would have talked to us about the persecuted church. They had a little table upstairs [youth was downstairs] with stuff about the persecuted church.

After the first lady was gone because of her legs...youth group got so bad it was pretty much only about projects eventually. And I think the pastor,she got upset because we weren't working hard enough or something. I forget exactly, I just remember she was upset. The projects were I think to raise money so we could go on a church trip. I wasn't allowed to go because mom is very protective. I think it was out of town. It was basicly fruitless. I left that church.

I went to a church last Fall. I was in denial of how bad it was...it was very seeker driven. Thankfully, the Lord got me out of there. At first I liked it. But than little things sent of red flags. Gangum Sytle [people in the seats weren't bothered, they loved it] was on one time before service on the screen [and often secular music from like the 70s]. First time I seen it and was creeped out. And than there was the singer that did the satanic salute. I was too scared to confront him. After all we were told not to tell anyone if they were sinning,or something like that. The Holy Spirit would convict them.

I should have told "Becca",the one who took me,after the service...I should have told her I didn't like it the first day. Too many blinking lights and it was too loud. Flashing lights and loud rock music,"Christian" music that is. I got myself used to it and picked a few I liked. So many songs were just fruitless though. The sermons ended up even watered down. I remember one time the pastor was telling us no matter the president in office...I forget exactly how he said it but I know he didn't want anything negative said about the president. Yes,even if the president is for abortion and gay marriage,doesn't matter. He made it sound like if anything negative would be said that we'd be sinning.

The pastor scared me one time. He said if any of us have complaints [such as with the music,seating,etc...] than we can get out and leave.

All yeah,they had scripture on the big screen so we didn't have to bring our Bibles. It would have been too difficult to read anyways since so much of the place was dark. It wasn't dark where the pastor was at but where we were sitting it was too dark to read. That is a big red flag right there...

I think I read somewhere before that if a church constently asks for money that's a red flag. Well,that's what happened in T.E. They asked like every single time for us to tieth [there may have been one time they forgot]. One sermon was pretty much all about money. I prayed that they wouldn't ask but they just had to keep asking. I think the pastor wanted us to start all tiething. I think he even wanted us to go as far as 30 or 40%.

So,by what I've told you that church was fruitless. That "Christian" pastor didn't teach me what I needed to know ether.

So,the JWs are the only ones who have "taught" me for atleast a couple years. Thankfully,Bible Study got finished a long time ago. And they haven't visited in a long time [and the reason the elder's wife and whoever else would be brought don't visit is because she doesn't know how to open the gate. She puts watchtowers over/under the gate though.]

Now you know who has "taught" me face to face. I realize the problem is that what I've been told about the cross is about all I've ever been told about the cross from people face to face. I guess you could say brainwashing has happened even though I never became an actual member and have only been in Kingdom Hall a few times in my life [I think twice for that memorial and once just to visit. Haven't been there in over a year though].

I need your advice. How can I not be scared to talk about the cross? I've talked about His death in the past[like mentioning atleast a couple times at home that He died for our sins and I've told people online] ,that He's died for our sins. It scares me to mention the cross. It scares me because they've inserted the terms "pagan" and "idol" with the cross and I remember being asked about the electric chair or knife...

I know the cross isn't pagan. I'm just scared.

I hope no one is mad at me for opening up to you guys about this. I hope Jesus isn't mad or ashamed. I know the cross is very important I just don't know how to break through the barrior in my mind that has been put up.

How about saying something like: "We wear the cross around our necks not because it is an instrument of death, but because it is symbolic of our redemption. And the difference between the cross being an instrument of death compared to an electic chair or a knife is that the Lord was resurrected and is alive today. His death was temporary, being resurrected on the third day, in order for His blood to cleanse us from our iniquities. So instead of an instrument of death, the cross is an instrument of life in order to redeem us from our sins."

The comparison of the cross and the electric chair is so bizarre that I found it difficult to address rationally. After all, if a person cannot grasp the meaning of the cross, then refuting the electric chair analogy as absurd will not be as effective.

The original comment was intended as a joke, and jokes are often designed to short-circuit logical responses.

I found this piece, which deals with the false comparison much better than I could:

http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/tgc/2012/08/15/factchecker-the-cross-an-electric-chair/

Fair Use For Educational and Discussion Purposes

The cross is the symbol of the greatest triumph in human history. God demonstrated his love for his creation on that cross. If it weren't for the cross we would all be doomed to hell. Jesus laid down his life on that cross and it was of his own volition. God put the southern cross in the sky and arranged the came of Israel in the wilderness in the shape of a cross. It is not pagan or sick in any way.

Thank you Lisa,David and Shrimp. And David I'll check out the link.

I mean I know why the cross has meaning because Jesus died on it for us to forgive us of our sins. No one died from a knife or an electric chair to save us from our sins.

I guess my main problem is that a barrior has been put up after hearing their "reasons" for so long. You could say it was brainwashing. How can the barrior come down though?

The best way to get over the brainwashing of the JW's, is to go directly to the word of God. Here are a few verses that tell us, and remind us, of the wonder of the cross. Also, keep reminding yourself that the JW's are a cult, and just about everything they tell you, is false. One example; they don't believe that Jesus Christ was actually God manifest in the flesh. They tell you that He is Michael the Arch Angel. If they've got that so wrong, why believe anything else that they tell you? Now, go and pick up your cross, and follow Him. :) Luke 9:23

Again, read these verses, and it will do even more good, if you go to each verse and read the chapter, getting it all in it's proper context. :)

Rom 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

1Cr 1:18 ¶ For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

1Cr 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumbling block, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

Phl 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, [I say], whether [they be] things in earth, or things in heaven.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Hbr 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of [our] faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

And this lovely video, kind of says it all.

When I Survey The Wondrous Cross:

What???? The JWs know to avoid my door now. I have a reputation of shutting the door when they start arguing with me.

Like with many things, i think there is an element of truth to the idea we shouldn't wear crosses, if it becomes a substitute for what it really stands for. What i mean is you have certain denominations who actually believe the cross itself has power, which makes it an idol. How many times have you seen Hollywood use this in their media, where the vampire hunter [just as an example] actually keeps his toothy enemy at bay with the cross... Nope, sorry, that piece of wood means nothing, except perhaps as a reminder.... but do we really need one?

I think most people wear them just as a sign to other believers... but the cross also means different things to different people, so that can become a problem too.. The power is not in the cross, its in the shed blood and resurrection. Its in the blood of Yeshua that was placed on the mercy seat on our behalf - wearing a cross around our neck has no effect on that. I see lots of wolves wearing them.

When i first became a Christian i wanted to wear a cross, but then after i got one i realized, this thing is just a symbol of death... and i don't need it. Everyone is different, though.. I certainly don't judge someone who wears one, because i try to ascribe to them doing so the best of intentions.

Phl 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

It's a good example, and a reminder to us.

While I agree that's it's a personal choice for a person to wear a cross, and that it has been portrayed badly in some movies, the 'tree, stake, cross', whatever you want to call it, represents God's love for us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ Died for us.

As I mentioned above, it also represents the manner of death our Savior undertook for us, and His Obedience to His Father's will. Even His death on the cross. He took upon Himself the curse of sin and death. Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed [is] every one that hangeth on a tree:

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

I look at it this way. If I wear my cross, that doesn't mean I look at it as an idol. It's a statement of what Yeshua did for me and you...a statement of my belief. It's also a reminder. It's not a replacement. It helps me to go through my daily activities and keep seeking His will and hearing Him...as in, "What do You want me to do, Lord?" It helps me to treat others as He would want me to treat them.
Now, if that's idolatry, I don't know. I know there are people who wear a cross as just a piece of jewelry. But I don't judge people for wearing a cross. My behavior should reflect what I have hanging around my neck.

Thank you all very much for commenting.

And Chris N. I'm listening to the song. It's very pretty.

I guess the best thing I can ask is for you guys to pray Jesus removes the barrior that's been put up. I know the cross is a wonderful reminder of what Christ did for us. It's just going to take time for the barrior to be removed. I know fear and guilt were used to help "prove" their point. I need your prayers that Jesus brings His healing touch and erases any brainwashing [including that of things I might not even realize that I've been brainwashed with].

Thank you all. :hugs: